check this studio

outraygeous dj

its not about the eqiupment, but the idea, ask daniel beddingfield

djentropy

....to watch this arguement/discussion unfold, the classic computer vs hardware or analog vs digital debate.

I am strictly computer, and always have been, with the exception of having a Juno 106, which I just sample anyway. No MIDI for me, never saw a need for it.

I use primarily Reason now...used to use Acid, then moved to Reason. I also use Soundforge, ReCycle, WaveSurgeon, OrionPro, CoolEdit, DART, etc, etc, etc.....

I have never seen a need to have gear, with the exception of just raw sounds, but you can find any raw sound you ever want (and a million more) on the internet, or in mp3s. That's the fun of it all to me...find something, and make it your own. If I need a snare, I find a snare in some random rock song somewhere, change it to where I like it, and use it....if I need a kick, I go look for some kick I need, and make it my own. If I need a vocal, I go find one, and make it my own. Etc, etc, etc......with the advent of file-sharing systems people now have access to practically every piece of recorded music ever, and if THAT isn't enough for ya, then go get a softsynth.....and if you really want to, buy a synth. I honestly don't see the need to buy any gear beyon a synth for raw sounds, if you want them. Everything else is done just as good, and I think BETTER, by software. I have spent long hours in $30,000+ studios only to make something I coulda made in 20min on software. Doesn't make sense to me.

It also lowers the bar, and levels the playing field, and takes the music making to the "non-rich", and the more people that make any music is better, imo. Sure, there will be more crap, but there will be more wikked tunes as well, and that's good in my book!

I honestly feel bad for the "studio warriors", because I know if I spent $40,000 on a studio and found out a few years later that warez can do all of that for free on a $1000 computer, I'd be pretty pissed too, but for all you out there, embrace the technology, don't fight it.



-Ian Entropy

JJ

“	Originally posted by djentropy ....to watch this arguement/discussion unfold, the classic computer vs hardware or analog vs digital debate. I am strictly computer, and always have been, with the exception of having a Juno 106, which I just sample anyway. No MIDI for me, never saw a need for it. I have never seen a need to have gear, with the exception of just raw sounds, but you can find any raw sound you ever want (and a million more) on the internet, or in mp3s.	”

mp3's? your having a laugh right? mp3's are about 5% the quality of an SDII 16bit 44.1khz file.

I dont use any digital audio to write tracks with unless its 24bit 96khz.

people like you cant really comment on this subject because i can tell that you have very little or even no experience in top end studio's.

let me ask you somthing. lets say i had a client come in with two reels of 24 channel tape and they wanted to remix down their track... their drummer played a 4 to the floor break but they only wanted a two step break on the track, the only way that this is possible to quickly fix is to side chain the snare from a compressor into the back of a gate thats on the kick drum channel this would result in gating out the 2 and 4 kicks.... how would you (mr, I have never seen a need to have gear) do that with your sequencing software....????

i'll tell you how, you wont! because its not possible yet because side chaining has only just been includded in logic audio 5 which isnt even out yet.

you would have to sit there and bounce the tracks into pro tools then sync up the tape using smtpe time code and then delete each other kick drum for the whole track untill it drove you insane.

thats just one thing out of a million things in a studio that i cant do just on my G4.

p.s the SSL sound is impossible to duplicate using software.

anyway, carry on with your cheap studio and make tunes that sound like $$$$.

most people in the buiz would laugh at your last statement but i thought i would take the time to explain a little bit about what you dont know

oh yeh and you need not feel sorry for us who spend alot of money on gear because we have a reason to as we wouldnt have purchased it otherwise, also we can always sell our gear and get a good price for it to people who want to expand their little computer settups after they have realised that their end result isnt of quality.

Neil aka Riplash

Personally, I find systems based totally in a PC environment at best fiddly to use and at worst a crashing, jittery nightmare.

Computers are superb for certain tasks (sample editing for example), and yes, in the last 5 years the software synths have reached a point where most people wouldn't be able to tell the difference, but from a practical point of view I think computer systems still lag behind. Trying to undertake a mixdown of a complex piece using just a mouse is a total mission, and even with MIDI control surfaces I find I don't have access to the paramaters I need at the moment I need them.. I'll take a Mackie 24/8 over the VST or Logic mixer any day, and the same goes for effects units and synths which are on the whole far more reliable as pieces of hardware (in my experience).

Oh btw.. Entropy, I was sure your name was familiar so I asked a friend, and indeed we've come accross you in the past. Post up your website address (please), I'm sure the members of ukmusic.comorldwide could do with a good belly laugh at tracks like Vegemite Sandwich.

Tux

JJ....

You sound a bit vexed mate... Has djentropy touched a raw nerve?

You say that today's soft studios sound like 'crap' but I have to disagree there. I think entropy's statement about people spending shedloads on hardware only for it all to be out moded by software has rattled you. Is it cos you work in a commercial studio and are worried about a dip in bookings?


SSL desks and real analogue fx do sound the business. A real accoustic piano (after the human voice) is (to some) the most expressive instrument on the planet. Software can't touch them....Yet.

But can you put your hand on your heart and say software won't find a way round the current hurdles it's facing? Who would have thought a decade ago that you could fit an entire studio in a PC?

Even the editorial of this months Sound On Sound magazine concedes that the future lies in software. The editor ask's us to support the major software houses cos we're probably gonna be relying more heavily on them in the coming years.

Technology will never replace hardware, they'll alway's be people who want to play a real guitar or flute or whatever. But I see the day when technology will be a viable alternative. Companies wouldn't be throwing thousands of pounds and man hours in R&D if they didn't think it was worthwhile..

To brand soft studio's and the sound's they produce as 'crap' is a bit harsh and smack's a bit of snobbery.

Remember the band 'Orbital'? They had a number 1 hit in 1990 with the track 'Chime'. It was recorded on a 4 track using a chrome cassette....

Tux

It's funny times we're livin in. First there was hardware. Then there was 3rd party software to control the hardware. Then there was software versions of the hardware. Now we're getting to the stage where hardware manufacturers are designing custom control surfaces for major software!

And I think, Neil aka Riplash, that's where we're headed. As you say, software is a bit fiddly but Pro tool's, Cubase and now Logic users all have custom hardware for their apps.

And I believe Reason users now have a hardware control surface in the shape of a keyboard called the 'Re-mote' made buy Novation. Does anyone out there have this?

JJ

“	Originally posted by Tux It's funny times we're livin in. First there was hardware. Then there was 3rd party software to control the hardware. Then there was software versions of the hardware. Now we're getting to the stage where hardware manufacturers are designing custom control surfaces for major software! And I think, Neil aka Riplash, that's where we're headed. As you say, software is a bit fiddly but Pro tool's, Cubase and now Logic users all have custom hardware for their apps. And I believe Reason users now have a hardware control surface in the shape of a keyboard called the 'Re-mote' made buy Novation. Does anyone out there have this?	”

theres been hardware controllers for over 5 years though ( ive been able to assign my modulation up fader on my keyboard to contoll a software upfader on screen) its not new.... they are only assigned midi controllers... maybe, now they have made the interface usb but at the end of the day its all the same...

djentropy

“	JJ said mp3's? your having a laugh right? mp3's are about 5% the quality of an SDII 16bit 44.1khz file. I dont use any digital audio to write tracks with unless its 24bit 96khz.	”

Obviously you can boost the sounds...

Spend some time in Soundforge, bro.....you can make any sample from 128kbps on sound proper with the right processing.

>people like you cant really comment on this subject because i >can tell that you have very little or even no experience in top >end studio's.

I have spent a fair amount of time in "top-end" studios...by what you define "top-end" as. I don't concern myself with that though. The music is what matters, not how you make it.

>let me ask you somthing. lets say i had a client come in with two >reels of 24 channel tape and they wanted to remix down their >track... their drummer played a 4 to the floor break but they only >wanted a two step break on the track, the only way that this is >possible to quickly fix is to side chain the snare from a >compressor into the back of a gate thats on the kick drum >channel this would result in gating out the 2 and 4 kicks.... how >would you (mr, I have never seen a need to have gear) do that >with your sequencing software....????

Removing the drums from a track? Easy, I do it all the time. Soundforge does quite well in such matters.....pinpoint the prequency and gate it out.

>anyway, carry on with your cheap studio and make tunes that >sound like $$$$.

Wow, bitter, aren't we? Did I strike a nerve? Does it upset you that I have tunes out, using software, and you don't have tunes out, using gear? Pisses you off, doesn't it? lol

-Ian Entropy

djentropy

“	Neil aka Riplash said: Oh btw.. Entropy, I was sure your name was familiar so I asked a friend, and indeed we've come accross you in the past. Post up your website address (please), I'm sure the members of ukmusic.comorldwide could do with a good belly laugh at tracks like Vegemite Sandwich.	”

Haha, that tune isn't online anymore...hasn't been for a year or more.

That was one of my first tunes I did completely myself (in my own studio, not a gear studio), from 1998? or so...something like that.....hehehe

Fun stuff for the time

I have newer stuff up on my site: http://www.djentropy.com

-Ian Entropy