Is UKG UK's Hip Hop? Debate

[Heartless Nigga]

A QUESTION?
FiveTimesFive have created ‘Black Nerd’ - a platform for hip hop as a culture of ideas - and they are holding a discussion asking the questions ‘have the expectations of UK hip hop been too high? Is garage in fact the UK's hip hop, with its own distinctive vocabulary and sensibility?’ If so, where does this leave British hip hop, especially as prominent artists like New Flesh, The Streets, So Solid Crew, Ms Dynamite and Fallacy and Fusion continue to blur the boundaries between the two. Speakers in the day include Timmi Magic from Radio 1, Big Dada label manager Will Ashon, journalist, DJ, producer and lecturer Steve Goodman, Tony Rotton from Black Twang and Juice Aleem from New Flesh. Should be an interesting debate!
24 Sept - ICA, The Mall, London. Tickets £8/£7/£6
Info: 020 7930 3647
http://www.fivetimesfive.com
http://www.ica.org.uk

Personally I think not. Yes Garage MC's are british and sptiitng rhymes but it aint Hip Hop!!!

[missc]

those ICA events are great. Def check this one.

[DJFRESH]

Uk Garage is Uk Hip hop in the sence that its the culture of many young people, to be honist you cant go out to hip hop clubs there are some buts its manly Rnb. Hip hop in the usa is not just a music its a whole culture, u can see it in the soure its the garms, what u eat, what u smoke, its the whole thing and uk garage is the same.

the sounds are also getting very simalar look at pulse X, just beats and bass, very much like early hiphop, we are ten years behind the Usa in many aspects but this is just another one.

[Heartless Nigga]

No way. I think it's a blatent kick in the face to the cats that have been struggling for the last 10 - 15 years when they say "UKG is is UK Hip Hop"

[DJ EL SID]

UK Hiphop is dead. emulating american artists and american music will and has never run in London. People say its blowing up, but where? UK RnB on the other hand is fairing better.

UK garage is UK's answer to hiphop - especially nowadays with all this sublow/slapbeat stuff - like wiley, dizzee etc - garage is allowing mc's to run da mic.

Hiphop in america for hiphop fans is life. You dont have that same sort of dedication and addiction so to speak to it here.

garage and dnb/jungle have always been the music that the "heads" have listened to - its always been the street sound - its our version of hiphop.

people say garage is hiphop now - because lyrics are in prominence - doesnt matter if it aint the same beat.

[KRAZY D]

i have never read so much $$$$$$$s!! - uk hip hop is wicked look on skinnyman and mud family etc...

ukg is completley diferent for 1 its dance music and although it has similaritys to hip hop it dont make it hip hop

thats like saying that jungle is the new jazz or some dumb $$$$ like that - it is what it is people should stop trying to associate things and let them be what they are

[DJ EL SID]

uk hiphop may be good. but its nothing really. apart from roots manuva, mark b/blade and some of fallacy's stuff - who has blown up?
rodney p - is doing garage now....u get me? not hiphop!

[KRAZY D]

you obviousley dont know much about the scene then brer the uk have a style of hip hop like no other country could hold down

bare people have blown up it depends what scene you put yourself in - look at task force and aspects (local boys to me ) there albums are smashing it - although the uk havent brought through stars like dmx or shady - they have a humungous underground following and most of them hate garage

[DJ EL SID]

truesay. i remember seeing aspects and task force all the time round bristol.

but they aint known outside their manor - (aspects had a critically acclaimed album i remember - but did it shift units?) unlike a so - solid album etc?

what do u reckon of the streets?

[[agx]]

Yeah, its a kick in the teeth to the tuffjams and ramsey and fens who built UK garage in the mid 90s. They werent working on a cheap version of hiphop (speed hopage ), they were working on somehting very unique and very British.

Its also a cheek that their unique genre got hijacked while its them that built it.

UK Hiphopers gotta accept that theyre market will not be the USA for at least another 10 years. And UK acts like Big Bruv? etc are trying to blow up before the scenes developed.

They gotta accept that early uk hiphopers have to be the foundations - meaning they have to make stuff now to develop the scene in 5 years time, be unsung heros and not try and get onto TOTP. e.g: tuffjam built up UKG from 1993 up?.... and whos makin Gs in the USA? Yes, Daniel Bed with cheap beats in his bedroom. If I was Karl Brown/mat jam, Id be like: eh wtf.

Lastly, the same people saying:
Uk hiphops $$$$

Will you be buying USA UKG or will you be callin them wannabes too? Exactly. Self hating. No pride in this country. Yanks will big up any US UKG they do, truss.

[MC Carnage]

UK Hip Hop should not be in the shadow of UK Garage like this. They are completely different games. There is talent in Hip Hop which is completely different to the talent in UK Garage MCs.

verdict - no. they are very different.

[SoulFonik]

UK Hip Hop is large
I'm actually a bit more impressed by alot of hip-hop coming out of the UK than the US
of course the underground in the US is large but Glam Rap absolutely runs EVERYTHING in the mainstream
I still like a small amount of mainstream hip-hop cus some of the production is quality but lacks the lyrical content that people like Dilated Peoples etc. represent
it seems that alot of UK hip-hop MC's have been focusing very heavily on their Lyrical content
Garage IS NOT hip-hop
the scene might share some aspects of hip-hop culture but it is vastly different
I personally like the "upper class" image associated w/ UKG
I like to have fun in style when I go to the rave or a club
when it comes to hip-hop...
there needs to be a certain amount of depth in the lyrics
oh yeh...
Big Dada is LARGE
check it!
its one of the best hip-hop publications ever

[Tee Tee]

It's very simple really - Britain has always had a street culture: in the late 80s it was UK hip hop (anyone remember Music Of Life Records?), then hardcore, then jungle, now 'UK Garage'.

Lyrics have been a constant companion to these sounds - it's only now with UK Garage, a style of music so heavily hybridised, that the lyrical side predominates in a such a way that invokes comparisons with hip hop.

Britain injected the bassline into what was initially a US style but now majors etc seem keen to modify UK Garage as 'Hip Hop'...

The longevity of the Drum and Bass scene, exported worldwide. suggests that UK flavours are at their best when they stick to their guns and refuse to regress to please the marketing men!

[Heartless Nigga]

Karl Hinds album out on Monday.
Gonna invest in that.

Moorish Delta 7 have an album out in October. I heard one of there singles on MTV and the lyrics were deep!!!

Rodney P is still Hip Hop!!!

[[agx]]

Originally posted by SoulFonik
UK Hip Hop is large
I'm actually a bit more impressed by alot of hip-hop coming out of the UK than the US
of course the underground in the US is large but Glam Rap absolutely runs EVERYTHING in the mainstream

oi, big it. Its people like you, being an american, that will give UKHH some credibility having grown up with the real stuff. And nice non-inbred attitude you got there man.

Honestly, it is true to say UKHH is young and the productions are really rushed and havent found a market (does one produce US style for the masses - who may reject it as substandard US wannabe, or develop a raw underground sound that will pave the way but wont be too popular???etc), its young.

The hypocrite viewpoint I have is that:
As much as I wudnt mind UKHH being recognised on some kinda scale, I know it will never reach USA, however, USA have made an impact on DNB and can impact UK Garage, so its gonna be one sided. USA doing all things and UK getting larfed at.

The day USA UKG is viewed higher than UK UKG (:S), thats when Im gonna get into Prog. Hard Trance Techno Glowstick beats

[SoulFonik]

I will SOMEDAY be producing UKG
(I'm going to school for audio engineering right now)
but don't expect to hear the sound u hear w/ Garage production here in the US
I'm a fan of quality vocal tunes
people like MJ Cole, Matt Jam etc. r my biggest influences
I didn't get into UKG for the beat patterns or the basslines, jus the vibe it gives me
truss me
I'm not gonna make u start spinnin glowsticks

[lady $arah]

im jus confused now....

[KRAZY D]

typical bird heh heh

[KRAZY D]

el sid - the streets to me are like marmite some i love some i HATE - im feelin the outlaw breaks version of weak become heros
but hate that recient one that was on the box all the time
good productions tho!